Curse

hazardouswaste · Jun 10, 2006, 12:05 AM // 00:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nivryx

...*assassin joins, a tank joins shortly after*
Tank: 'kick the assassin, get another tank'
Monk: 'I'll leave if you kick him'...

A statement like that, especially coming from a monk, is something I've been waiting to hear about. What was said there was just as powerful as the monk strike a little while ago.

Now if only people earlier in the game would figure it out..

I'm stuck groupless at the Temple if anyone wishes to give me a hand

ERMC · Jun 10, 2006, 06:20 AM // 06:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by hazardouswaste

I'm stuck groupless at the Temple if anyone wishes to give me a hand

hench it

anyways to the topic at hand

It also boils down that most players want to get in groups rather then start there own group. When i read your article you were talking about trying to join groups but you never metioned starting your own. Nothing wrong with this but people that start a group no matter the class get people wanting to join. When i played through with my monk i get tons of blind invites like always but i would never join a group i felt had a bad set up. You also have to remember players join with what they know works. Players know that you can get through the entire PvE game with a basic build with Tanks, necros, monks, ele and whatever else to fill the last spot. This basic cookie cutter build works throughout the entire game both chapters. The debate that every class has something to offer is mute because most players know this but know that these basic easy classes to play can get the job done no problem. Assassins have it bad i agree but look at the Mesmer players. I still say these players have it alot harder to get in groups then any other class. I disagree with what you said also about assassins being the hardest to play as i still think the Mesmer is. Most players don't know what they do so they sit on the bench.

One of the characters i took through factions was my Tyrian monk and honestly i didn't really have a hard time healing assassins. Yes alot of them in fact most of the ones i grouped with did stay in the aggro and take alot of hits but i never really had a problem healing them. Yeah alot of them died but whatever i didn't care no stress or anything usually got through missions no problem.

My advice to everyone that has a hard time getting in groups if it takes you longer then 5 minutes to find one start your own and if you don't want to do that hench it. To be honest you are not the first person to say what you said and will not be the last. The assassin discrimination is here and it is what it is.

arcady · Jun 10, 2006, 06:43 AM // 06:43

Everybody wants to be a ninja, most people have no idea what that means...

I leave it to the people who do, and happily play my spell casters instead.

Tanks have their role - there's got to be somebody who gets to spend half the game dead, and you don't want it to be you. So you get a tank. In DnD this was the guy who was rolling up a new PC every game session, so that I never had to.

Rogues, Assassins, etc... are handy to deliver that critical blow before your tank goes down. A lot of DnD people want the tank there, but most of them start to realize that the rogue is more valuable in the long run.

And tanks have a very quickly diminishing return. Their only purpose is to soak up damage so you don't have to - and you only need one guy to do that if you can position him right and keep the aggression on him. A second tank just means one less person with actual versatility. But a team of 'strike ninja's' works great if you know how to use it and you have that rube, er tank, in there to take the attention away from you.

Charqus · Jun 10, 2006, 07:56 AM // 07:56

It happens...
Groups will take you in but ya will get the groups with the snobby monks that dont.. Ya just need to get over it really... Oh and the title "L" is stupid

unienaule · Jun 10, 2006, 08:49 PM // 20:49

Threads of this nature have been made since the beginning of Guild Wars. (Note: This is part joke, part commentary.)

A Guide to Classes of Guild Wars:

Warriors: They just run up to enemies and die while shouting "HEAL MOR j00 MONK YOU ALL SUCK" (ragequits)

Rangers: Sit in the back of the fight and occasionally go to the bathroom. For the trapper variety, see warrior description. Rangers with pets just aggro everything onto you for fun.

Elementalists: Rain fire down on enemies because there aren't any other elements, and then run out of energy and scream for everyone to wait since they didn't bring any energy skills along.

Monks: They stand there and watch you die, then resurrect you just to watch you die again. They especially never try to keep Warriors or Assassins alive, because they have infinite energy.

Necromancers: Kill everything with minions until they lag out and their minions go berserk and kill you. Any necro without minions is a n00b.

Mesmers: Nobody actually knows what a mesmer really does. It appears they like to dance and wave their staff/wand around and make purple sparkles.

Ritualists: They are monks who failed monk school. They're terrible at everything, and not as good as monks.

Assassins: They rush in and try to tank the entire world while screaming "NARUTO!!!111" Or, they hit one enemy with one combo and then run away because they're out of energy since they suck.

lishi · Jun 10, 2006, 11:58 PM // 23:58

The probrem of assasin / mesmer are the fact the group of enemy organization are just terrible.

why take a assasin or mesmer to kill/shotdown a target when you can just nuke / barrage / minion / SS / trap all the enemy?

A area where all the mob group have a good amout of healing (most of healing enemy build sux at most) , protection , damage (like a pvp build) will make those profession more desiderable...

hazardouswaste · Jun 11, 2006, 04:30 AM // 04:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by Charqus

Oh and the title "L" is stupid

Don't know what happened there. (Topic glitch?) It's been sorted out now for those that didn't notice.

Loch · Jun 11, 2006, 05:14 AM // 05:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by arcady

And tanks have a very quickly diminishing return. Their only purpose is to soak up damage so you don't have to - and you only need one guy to do that if you can position him right and keep the aggression on him. A second tank just means one less person with actual versatility. But a team of 'strike ninja's' works great if you know how to use it and you have that rube, er tank, in there to take the attention away from you.

Hate to break it to you, but warriors aren't bad damage dealers at all. In fact, they dish out the highest damage-per-second in the game. Assassins are great at spiking with their combos, but they aren't built for constant upfront in-your-face combat like a warrior.

dgb · Jun 11, 2006, 05:55 AM // 05:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by hazardouswaste

A statement like that, especially coming from a monk, is something I've been waiting to hear about. What was said there was just as powerful as the monk strike a little while ago.

Now if only people earlier in the game would figure it out..

The problem is most assassins are clueless. It's oh so slowly improving yes, but it's still really painful to monk for a PUG assassin. Due to the general shortage of monks and their necessity to a group they can dictate the group (as your anecdote shows), and most of the time they don't want to take the risk of having an idiot assassin, which is a reasonably high probability.

Having personally copped a whole heap of abuse from assassins who don't have a clue how to play their class while monking, I've refused to take assassins who I don't know. I know there are good assassins out there who are unfairly taking the discrimination, but my sample of PUG assassins says that the majority have been mediocre, a significant minority have been horrible (talkign 1/3 here) and I've never seen a good PUG assassin. I'm sorry for the discrimination, but it will end when the assassin class as a whole starts playing seriously. I know what the class can do, I've had them in my builds extensively for GVG, it's just the people playing them don't.

J snukka · Jun 11, 2006, 06:16 AM // 06:16

I love my assassin. Love it but I don't love trying to get a group. When I am in a group I do my best at fighting. My main reason to posting here is to let other players know that if you see an assassin doing well, compliment them bc it is hard to constantly dish out good amount of dmg, get out of fight before dieing and go back in. Those assassins doing the right job, are working hard in-order to be effective in a group. Help them out and put them in friend list so they have players to play with when guildies arent on.

warriorsmiley · Jun 11, 2006, 06:16 AM // 06:16

Like most of the people say poor assassins make it hard on good to get into a group. When i was gettin my characters thru the game which i hench'd most of it knowing alot of people were gonna make assassins and to avoid being stuck with a bunch of assassins that didnt know what they doing i took the hench.When i did actually join a group for a mission which was rare we had a assassin or 2,the following happened after assassins ran in front of the warriors they got all the aggro on them monks strain there energy on them run out and boom you have dead assassins.Assassin "omg you stupid monks heal me you see me dying" Assassin left the game.We'd go on and get the mission/quest done easier then having that assassin in the party. This happened to me many many times now having horrible experience with every assassin i had in a group why should i give another assassin a chance. If you have a assassin and having a hard time finding a party you should turn back to the community and blame the ones that did the above for ruining it for everyone after them.

frojack · Jun 11, 2006, 07:36 AM // 07:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by unienaule

Assassins: They rush in and try to tank the entire world while screaming "NARUTO!!!111" Or, they hit one enemy with one combo and then run away because they're out of energy since they suck.

Lol! Now that was funny

. Good one unienaule. "NARUTO!!!!1111111".

UltimaXtreme · Jun 11, 2006, 08:15 AM // 08:15

The extent of every class depends directly on the players and not the class itself, any class can be amazing if the player behind it knows what their doing.

so stop saying rank does not mean jack in pve (insert tiger emote here).

Kattox1 · Jun 11, 2006, 08:31 AM // 08:31

I'm finding assassin discrimination is dying down. But you still get the occasional group who will kick you because theres a warrior who wants to join instead even though they already have 2 warriors. Meh.

I remember just a few weeks ago about an assassin who was group leader who was saying he was a tank and I was trying to explain to him the futility of his argument. Needless to say he was completely annihilated by the first group on vizunah square and he then went on to rage quit because the 1 monk in the party, (he said we only needed one!), couldn't keep him alive over the excessive amount of afflicted soul explosions, (all MY handy-work

).

My point is that getting rid of assassin hate is up to both groups, the assassins and the people who don't want them.

ps. ASSASSINS CAN'T TANK

Xaero Gouki Kriegor · Jun 11, 2006, 08:36 AM // 08:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zakarr

When you hit and run = you are a weak coward

Some warriors think assassins are alternative warriors which they want to beat and prove them to be weak. If you don't take 1 vs 1 with warrior, you are a coward but if you accept it and most likely die, you are a loser or n00b.

luckily ive never had this problem with assassins in ft aspenwood, the tank is usually the one that starts running, he starts running aroudn the time falling spider finally hits him lol, but i see what you mean

Siddious · Jun 11, 2006, 08:37 AM // 08:37

Tank? Damage Dealer? Spell Shutdown? The problem with assasins is nobody is quite sure what they are supposed to do. They just don't seem to fit the cookie-cutter-builds. Here is each classes job:

WARRIOR - Tank
MONK - Healer, Protection, Bonder
ELEMENTLIST - Nuker (Damage Dealer)
NECRO - MM, SS, Order, Tainted
RANGER - Interupter, Barrager, Trapper
MESMER - Interupter, Shutdown (can kill bosses with ease)
RITUALIST - Sprit Spammer, Healer (not as good at it as monks though)
ASSASIN - ?

Yet what is the assasins job?

Miakoda · Jun 11, 2006, 08:40 AM // 08:40

Most of the posters here seem very.. simplistic in their "yeah people just need to learn how to play" attitude.

Players seem to forget the re-balancing and skill re-working in order to make
certain playstyles more usefull, for example the Necro situation was only brought about by skills being redone or 'tweaked' in order to make them more desirable, that's how the MM became usefull.

It's not as if players didn't work out the potential of each class very early on, they did, trouble was the skills didn't allow for diversity, and thats exactly the same situation with the Assassin now, until certain elites and skills and maybe even crit strikes gets another look, then my Assassin and pve Assassins looking for invites will be rejected by those in the know.

You are not going to discover an uber assassin build at this stage and you are not going to change peoples minds, until Anet pulls their fingers out.

Tijger · Jun 11, 2006, 09:38 AM // 09:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by Siddious

Yet what is the assasins job?

Spiker?

Sounds as good a description as any.

Ellena · Jun 11, 2006, 09:45 AM // 09:45

It's most interesting to watch ritualists as compared to assassins. Rit is a relatively unpopular class to play compared to assassins ( in early factions, assassins were like half the characters youd' find). A rit can almost always find a group, and has almsot no criticism ever. As logn as a rit doenst pull aggro or go afk, no one seems to really care what they do or don't do.

People mostly don't understand what ritualists do, much better than they understand assasins, unless the rit is acting in a monk type role ( in which case, most people are very sympathetic, much as they are to a monking elementalist). The difference, I suppose is that a mysterious rit is assuemd to be doing soemthing useful that they dont understand, as opposed to perpetually dying, so at worst, a bad rit is worthless, whereas a bad assassin makes your monks ( and healer rits) quit.
I feel for assassins, but unless some one i knwo can vouch for them, I won't pug with them, that was doubly true when I was actign as a healer rit.

Caleb · Jun 11, 2006, 10:11 AM // 10:11

You know it's bad when this morning in my group I heard the following:

Jamei (Healer Henchman) - Kick that wanna be tank newb or else I am leaving.

Danika (Healer Henchman) - Panaku, you are not welcome here. Caleb please kick him and bring Lo Sha (Illusion Henchman), it has been a month since Factions release and Lo Sha has yet to be invited to a single party!

I tried to refute their opinions, but in the end I succumbed to the peer pressure and screamed "NO BooN NinGaz in my Grupz~1!!111!" and Panaku went back to isolation.
____

On a serious note, I have had several assassins in my groups that were excellent. Unfortunately, they are overshadowed by the majority of assassins who have required more healing than a makeshift hospital in Kabul.